On this episode of Follow the Money, Matt Grudnoff and Ebony Bennett discuss the latest job cuts at the CSIRO, why this is a missed opportunity as researchers leave the United States, and why science investment matters for productivity.

A time for Bravery: what happens when Australia chooses courage is available for pre-order now via Australia Institute Press. Use the code ‘SAVE5’ at checkout to save $5 off the price – available for a limited time only.

Aiming Higher: Universities and Australia’s future by Professor George Williams is also available now.

Guest: Matt Grudnoff, Senior Economist, the Australia Institute // @mattgrudnoff

Host: Ebony Bennett, Deputy Director, the Australia Institute // @ebonybennett

Show notes:

If the Government’s top priority is productivity, slashing the CSIRO budget does not make sense by Matt Grudnoff, The Point (November 2025)

The Wage Price Index (WPI) shows wages are up. So why doesn’t it feel that way? by Matt Grudnoff, The Point (November 2025)

Who needs world-changing, life-saving science when you’ve got rugby league? by Ebony Bennett, The Canberra Times (November 2025)

Theme music: Pulse and Thrum; additional music by Blue Dot Sessions

We’d love to hear your feedback on this series, so send in your questions, comments or suggestions for future episodes to podcasts@australiainstitute.org.au.